Our guest for this episode is Duane Bennet, father of the bestselling author Brit Bennett. Brit’s latest bestseller is a book called The Vanishing Half – a #1 New York Times Best Seller.
In addition to being one of my favorite books, The Vanishing Half has also been named as a Best Book of 2020 by Time Magazine, NPR, Vanity Fair, and many others. After a bidding war that involved 17 media companies, HBO has optioned The Vanishing Half and plans to develop it a limited series (Brit will be Executive Producer!).
Brit Bennett’s first book, The Mothers, was also a thought-provoking page-turner. In addition to being a bestseller, The Mothers has by optioned by Warner Brothers & Kerry Washington with the intent to produce a feature film.
Brit and her sisters, Jynna & Brianna, are fortunate to have Duane as their father. Duane and his wife were always extraordinarily supportive of their girls and created an environment that helped all of them to achieve their potential.
In this episode, Duane and I talk about a variety of topics, including: how to foster closeness between siblings, instilling a love of learning, the role of a father (what it is & what it isn’t), and why being right is overrated.
Enjoy the episode!
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Brit Bennett on the Web & Social Media
Web: https://britbennett.com/
Instagram: @britrbennett
Twitter: @britrbennett
Facebook: @britbennettwrites
Brit’s Books
The Vanishing Half: www.amzn.com/0525536299
The Mothers: www.amzn.com/B01BD1SSO4
The Vanishing Half: www.amzn.com/0525536299
The Mothers: www.amzn.com/B01BD1SSO4
Please forgive the errors in the transcript! Enjoy the episode!
Jonathan V.: Your daughter, Britt is an amazing writer. In addition to her, her essays at a very young age, she’s also written two novels, The Mothers and The Vanishing Half, both of which were bestsellers on the New York Times list. The Mothers as being adapted into a feature film, starring Kerry Washington. And there was a bidding war recently for the rights to adapt The Vanishing Half, which HBO. Just won just incredible success. But was there a point along this journey where you felt like, wow, Britt is really on her way? She could become a, you know, a world-class famous author, a literary star.
Duane Bennett: Well, Jonathan, I wish I could chill you yes, right off the bat. But when Britt got into Stanford and really, really show that she could read at an early age and really, really write, well, I thought her career would go somewhere else. When she said she wanted to be a writer. I always respect the books and writing. And her mother really, really instilled that in her early age. But I struggled to figure out how she would earn a living and how she would make it as a writer. So I was concerned with Britt in that regard. And so I wish I could say, I always know that she had this in her. And I always knew it was going happen, but what I did was I kind of stuck my car in neutral. You know, she went through college and when she said she wanted to go into the MFA program, I was a little leery and I was hesitant, but I didn’t dissuade, but I didn’t encourage also until she got accepted into the MFA program. And then I started seeing that this could really work for her. Then I got on board. So, I wish I could say, I wish I could say that early on. I always knew this. I didn’t. And I became a believer later than I wish I had jumped on board.
Jonathan V.: Yeah. It’s difficult sometimes though. Right? Because you want the best for your kids and there’s a certain desire to have security for them and know that they’re going to be able to provide for themselves. And it is a tough field to be a writer.
Duane Bennett: Yeah, I think so. And I see so many people who have done it and who write really, really well, but still struggle in a natural. And so I was concerned, you know, because you care for your family, you care, we have three daughters and I always wanted to see all of them do exceptionally well, but you know what? She always had determination. She had grit. She was an excellent student. She studied hard, she was determined. She could really, really read and write very, very well. So although I didn’t know, it would, it would come by way of books. I thought maybe she’ll teach. Maybe she’ll become a professor somewhere and was looking for something that was more stable from the standpoint of a regular, everyday job. But you know what, she proved me wrong and I’m glad she did.
Jonathan V.: Well, I can see where it would give you confidence when she got accepted to the MFA program at the University of Michigan. That’s an excellent MFA program. So, rolling back the clock could you tell us about what the Bennett household was like when Britt and your other two daughters were young?
Duane Bennett: Well, you know, my wife and myself and our daughters, I believe we’ve always had a close family. We grew up in a Christian household full of love as a family. We were nonjudgmental. We believe everybody was equal. We don’t believe that we’re inferior to anybody or superior to anybody. My wife really instilled within our daughters, the love of education and writing and determination. And I hope I did also, but I think, as a family, I think we function well. We didn’t have any challenges with any of our daughters at all. Not because we were perfect, but for some reason we just kept peace and calm in the household. And I think that attributed to their success.
Jonathan V.: You mentioned you and your wife instilled a love of learning. How do you do that?
Duane Bennett: Well, in particular, my wife really, really work with all the daughters during the school years. I did also, but my wife, Lena, she read to the daughters particularly Britt, she picked up reading really, really fast and they all were diligent in terms of their studies. And, you know, I think because of the way my wife and I were raised, she’s from Louisiana and she grew up poor and I’m from South central LA and I grew up poor and both of us realized the benefit of education, you know, as a way out. And it’s a way to make it. And it’s a way to, you know, make really make a better society for, for ourselves as well as others, you know, really, really strong in the civil rights movement really, really believed in civil rights, believed in civil rights and saw education as a means to an end. So we emphasized it in the house and all of my daughters picked it up and ran with it.
Jonathan V.: So you would talk about that with your daughters, not infrequently about the importance and the value of education.
Duane Bennett: We would, we would certainly do that. And you know, we, I think we exemplified it because they saw Lena work hard and they saw me work hard and they saw us read and they saw us. Right. And they saw us determined to make it. And I think that that served as a type of role model for all of them.
Jonathan V.: What line of work were you and your wife?
Duane Bennett: Well, my wife started in a very interesting way. We all have some law enforcement background. My wife started out working with the FBI as a fingerprint technician. Then she went to work for our County Sheriff’s Department and he stayed there examining fingerprints and helping law enforcement identify people who needed to be identified through fingerprints.
Jonathan V.: That’s so interesting. Plus, you come across these things and you wonder, how did anybody dream up that job for a character in their book? And that provides a little bit of insight into where Britt may have thought of that career for one of her characters in The Vanishing Half.
Duane Bennett: Yes. You saw that when she talked about the fingerprints, that’s all from her mother, as a matter of fact, The Vanishing Half takes place, the foundation in Louisiana, that’s her mother’s story also. So, you know, her mother left Louisiana at an early age to travel to Washington, DC, to work for the FBI and she left the small town. And so, I think a lot of Britt’s and inspiration come from her mother’s side.
Jonathan V.: Huh. Interesting. And you were in law enforcement in some capacity as well?
Duane Bennett: Yeah, I’m an attorney. So my first job was as a Deputy District Attorney and I was a prosecutor and I work with law enforcement and I went to the city attorney’s office, became the city attorney became general counsel, but in the context of my work and as an attorney, I represented police departments. So that’s where that connection is.
Jonathan V.: Got you. I imagine both you and your wife were, were busy. How did you approach your work-life balance?
Duane Bennett: Well, work-life balance is very important to me as it was to Lena also. And at one point we both worked outside the house and when our middle daughter was born, she had some health challenges. And as a father, I did not, I do not believe in the notion that the man controls the house and the man is the head. And so you do everything to me and say, it’s we didn’t, we didn’t run a household like that. We were equal in our household. And so when my middle daughter had a little bit of challenge at daycare, we decided that one of us had to stay home or should stay home with the children and the one who made the most money should, you know, keep working outside. And so we ultimately did that and really, really, I think set them on a path that encouraged the educational success and that helped them grow up to be fine young ladies at the same time, you know, I did my part as best I could to basically support their family and make sure everything was good. But we, I think that as a whole, there were times when both of us worked outside the house and there were times when only one of us worked outside the house. But I think as a whole, we were able to demonstrate a love for family, a love for each other, a feeling equality and a feeling of security so that everybody felt that the work-life balance was appropriate and that we were a family that could function without drama.
Jonathan V.: So it sounds like a very peaceful household that you’ve managed to cultivate any, any advice to fathers on how to approach establishing that kind of a tranquility within their own households.
Duane Bennett: Well, you know, as black parents and as a black man, black men get a bad rep as fathers. And we’re not bad fathers and there are some tremendous and some great fathers who are African Americans. And I think that first of all, you have to be secure in yourself so that you don’t feel that you have the responsibility to be Lord of your household. I never had that. I never, never, never went around talking about being the head of the house. I never felt it necessary to talk about I’m the head of the house. And you do what I say, because I don’t believe in it. I believe that marriage is equal and equality. And I think that the wife and the husband are equal, co-equals in household and it should be, it should be that I understand that they have to be a role that everybody has a role and everybody has a responsibility, but as a father, that’s my responsibility is not to be Lorded over my children, he lorded over my wife.
And act like I’m some King of a castle where everybody just does what I say. And so I never approached fatherhood like that, having three daughters, I love my daughters and all my heart. I’d die for my daughters and I sacrificed my life. And then even now I’m just working for them. I’m not working for myself anymore, but I think that as a father, as my responsibility, if you say I have a role to put them first, you know, to make sure that I cover the family from the standpoint of security protection, mentoring, but I don’t Lord fatherhood over my wife. And I know Lord husbandry over my wife and fatherhood over my children. So I think that, you know, where fathers are secure, they can be excellent mentors. They can put their families first. They can love the family. They can provide positive role models and, you know, be that parent that we all want and the parent that we all need.
Jonathan V.: In the example you provided earlier, where you needed to make a choice about which spouse should stay home, you and your wife had a good dialogue about that and came to a conclusion. Was that a habit that the two of you had when faced with big decisions, would you typically, did you typically find time to confer, to discuss how to approach things together?
Duane Bennett: You know we always discuss things and we still do. You know, I don’t, you know, I don’t feel adequate enough to run the life of my wife and run the life of my children. I think that it’s a collaboration. And if the family is going to a function best, you have to have great communication. And look, I’ve done some stupid things. I’ve done some dumb things. I’ve gone out. I’ve gotten ourselves, I’ve gotten a family in some financial stress and strain, but I’ve always believed it best when we talk through issues and we work together and we walk together.
Jonathan V.: Would the two of you find time for each other as well? I know it can be challenging when you’ve got careers or family obligations.
Duane Bennett: Yeah. I think we were, I, we, you know, we took vacations together. We had time together. So a lot of our life was circumscribed around our children for sure. But that’s the way we both wanted it. And so we always had time for each other and, you know, working hours never became too great such that either one of us were ignored. Both of us were busy, you know, doing something. We were always busy doing something, but we always had time to come together, but we have plenty of time together. And now that I’m retired, she probably thinks I have too much time. She’s retired and I’m retired. So I don’t know. So we’ve had plenty of time to work on our relationship.
Jonathan V.: That’s good with regards to your girls growing up. Were there any certain particular expectations that you had chores, rules, things that were part of the Bennett household that come to mind?
Duane Bennett: Oh yeah, of course. We asked them to straighten up the rooms. You know, we all, look as a father myself. I pick up after myself and my wife picked up after herself. And so we were trusted that the daughters to pick up after themselves and straighten up the rooms sometimes at work. And sometimes it didn’t, but we, you know, we wanted them, I trust and prayed that we showed in the how to be strong, that there is nothing that you, as a woman can’t do that nobody is better than you. You’re not better than anybody else. That you don’t need anybody to Lord their lives over you, or to rule over you you’re equal with everybody. And we wanted them to make sure that they achieve their goals, regardless of what anybody else said.
Jonathan V.: Do you recall any times where one of your daughters experienced some struggles where you needed to coach them through that situation?
Duane Bennett: Yes. And that’s an ongoing challenge because those struggles come all the time. And I think that what my wife and I both tried to do is be as supportive as we could be. And my wife, it’s interesting, you know, being married because she can see things that I can’t see. I have certain limitations, as a father I can see certain things and there are certain things I can’t see. And I’m kind of linear in my thinking. So I am more of a problem solver, if just by nature. My nature is to try to solve a problem quickly. Right. But my wife has a another side where she can see a lot farther than I can and she can anticipate things I can’t. And I have to go to her a lot of time to ask her how the daughter is doing and she’ll know she can sense that there’s something not right. And I, and I, it just goes right by me. I don’t see it. You know, I don’t see it. You know, she can see it. And that’s why I think we work well together.
Jonathan V.: Can you think of an example, a time when that may have happened?
Duane Bennett: Yeah. If I can think of one right now and it’s a very personal, but it was a trying time for one of our daughters and it was difficult for all of us. It was difficult for the whole family because when one of us hurts, all of us do, and my wife saw it before I did. She recognized it was going to be a challenge before I did. And I, you know, I guess I try to be optimistic, as a person I just try to see the best in everybody. And so I don’t want to think that anything’s wrong with a situation. I always want to give people the benefit of the doubt. And sometimes you just can’t do that. And I’m learning that. It’s something that I have had to learn that even though you might think everybody’s intentions are good. That’s not always the case. The thing that drives me to distraction and this society, and among some people, if the judgment and the constant condemnation, you know, if you don’t think like, I think, or you don’t see things away, I see it. You don’t believe the way I do. We’re going to condemn you. And I can’t stand that. And so, you know, as a father and my wife and I, we don’t condemn any of our daughters. We don’t, you might make a mistake. Maybe you miss it. Right. I have, I do. And so it’s not right for me to just condemn somebody and judge people for what they’ve done, even if they made a mistake. I mean, which one of us hasn’t? So you know, we were always there, somebody slips and somebody falls, you know, you try to help them get up and don’t condemn them to the point that they feel that they have no value, no worth. And if they’re so dumb, I’m so stupid. I made a mistake, but we can all say that about one another.
Jonathan V.: I read that you had said being right is overrated. Is that correct? And if so, could you elaborate on that?
Duane Bennett: Absolutely correct. It is overrated. People spend more time trying to convince somebody that they’re right about something. And it’s just overrated. I think that, you know, it’s okay. You know, I can believe that I’m right. And I’m correct about a position and you might disagree with me. Okay. Let’s just walk away in love. I mean, why do I have to be right? Why do I have to spend all my time to convince you that I’m right. To the point that it destroyed our relationship? You know, I’m fine to telling people, look, let’s just agree to disagree. Okay. Okay. You think, you think it’s up and I think it’s now, and then we could spend time, hour after hour, just trying to convince each other that it’s up, it’s up, it’s up and you don’t see it. And then we get into arguments and debates over nothing. Those senseless debates don’t help anything. I mean, you ended up getting upset with somebody just to convince somebody that you’re right. It’s overrated. It’s okay. You can disagree with me. That’s okay.
Jonathan V.: And oftentimes those are the people that you care about the most, right? We’re not having those conversations with strangers on the street necessarily. Oftentimes it’s a friend, a colleague, a spouse, a child.
Duane Bennett: Yes. Yes. And you know, you have to let people make their own judgments and their own decisions for themselves. That’s the one other thing that, you know, as a father and as a parent, I’ve done. And I think my wife is the same way. I mean, look, ultimately, you know you know, when people tell you, if it were me, you always have to watch out for that because it’s not you, if it were me, I would do this. If it were me, I try my best not to make that mistake. Although I’ve done it, I’ve made it mistake a whole bunch of times telling people if it were me, I’d do it this way. But you know what I realized, and the older I get, I realized, yeah, it’s not you, Duane. It’s not you. And allow them to live their lives, whether it’s your life or whether it’s what you think is correct or not, it’s their life. And it’s their decision. And you have to allow them to make that decision and live their life. Now you can help them.
You can show them, you know, as a parent, my role is to show, you know, a different side of it. And as a lawyer, I might see something different than you see. And maybe I just want to make sure that you understand these ramifications. This is an issue, and this is the issue. Now once I explained it to you, or once I demonstrate it to you, okay, you have to make your call. You have to make your call, and you have to live your life. It’s not up to me to condemn you because you don’t agree with me. And just like I tell people all the time and like, somebody once told me. I can explain it to you, but I can’t understand it for you, so you have to make your own thoughts.
Jonathan V.: It reminds me somewhat of some of the best marriage advice that I got. Sometimes it’s better to be nice than to be right. And that changed my perspective. I think that I was caught in that trap that you were describing of wanting to convince my wife, that I was right about something. And it might be something just absolutely unimportant. And I would get wrapped around the axle because I couldn’t believe that she didn’t see it my way. And who knows if I was right. I think that it helped me to reframe that or at least to step back and think about, is this something that’s important enough to spend time and strain the marriage to try to convince my wife that, you know, she needs to believe something that I believe, or is it better just to let it go and to be nice or just to agree to disagree?
Duane Bennett: Yeah. That’s how you save marriages. I mean, Jonathan, you know, whole bunch of times I’ve been wrong. I mean, and sometimes I think I’m right. And I, I can think of a time, not too long ago with a DMV experience where I just knew I was right. And my wife was overdoing it and she was meticulous. And I was like, Oh, we don’t need to do that. We don’t need to do that. We don’t need, as soon as I got to the DMV, I realized she was right. I was wrong. It didn’t take, as soon as I got up to the window, I realized, Oh my God, I played the fool. She was right all a long. So, so I know I’m not right all the time. And I, you know, I think that trying to convince people about how right you are is overrated. I think you’re wasting time. And I think a lot of times, even if you have a point, you make your point, if they don’t accept the point and they understood it, that’s fine. That’s as far as you can take it, move on.
Jonathan V.: Yep. That’s right. You mentioned you see, you’ve got two other daughters Britt’s, the youngest what are your other daughters names and what do they do?
Duane Bennett: Okay. I have Jynna and Jynna works at USC. She works in the library department. One of the campus librarians and Brianna works for charter schools. She’s the middle daughter. And so she works for charter schools. All of our daughters in some respect are involved in education somehow, you know, Britt and then the fine arts and Brianna works for the charter school administration company, and Jynna works for USC at the library. So everybody has some little part in education.
Jonathan V.: Interesting. And how was the dynamic between them when they were young? Do they get along? Were there things that you did to, to foster a good relationships between your daughters?
Duane Bennett: Yeah, I think they have excellent relationships. It’s funny because Jynna is so much older than the others, but they are all really, really, really close. I think, you know, I think the best thing that we did my wife and I as parents. If I had to look back on my life and say, what’s the best thing. I think having the three daughters and having them be as close as they are, is the best thing a parent can hope for. You know, how we say it? You know, we started out with one daughter, then we had two and only thing better than having two daughters is having three daughters. So, and so to see them grow up and mature his young ladies and be as close as they are and free as they are to one another and they’re supportive of one another. They are I don’t think of the parents who could ask for anything more.
Jonathan V.: Are there things that you’d recommend that parents can do to help foster that closeness between their kids?
Duane Bennett: Support all of them don’t make distinctions between them. We didn’t make distinctions between them. Even right now, you know, with Britt and Brianna and Jynna, we try not to make distinctions between them. Don’t pit one against the other, you know, the notion that, well, your sister is doing better than you and this and this, you know, that competition, we didn’t have that competition. Nobody encouraged competition among our daughters. You know, we encouraged them to love each other, look out for one another protect and basically be friends to one another. And that’s what they become, you know, and the older they get, the closer they seem to get. So I think that, you know, as parents, you can set that example. I mean, you don’t, we didn’t have to talk down to any of our daughters, you know, regardless of whether you made a mistake or not, you know, the notion that you made this horrible mistake, and this is the worst thing that could have happened. Yes. They made mistakes. But so have I.
And so, if my wife and, you know, you have to go back and sometimes catch yourself and realize that we all have been there at some point in time. And so to the extent that you can love them, unconditionally show support and be there when they really need you to be there. I think that’s how you help nurture that relationship. Also, I think you have to be a sounding board and my wife is better at this than me. I try to be a good listener. I work on it, but you know, my linear nature as an attorney is to listen for a second and then start trying to figure out a solution, trying to fix something. And that’s just one of my frailties. And one of the weaknesses I have I’m kind of, I get into the problem-solving mode really, really quickly. And sometimes I’m not as good at listening as I should be. So I’m working on that. I’m working on that. I’m developing that skill, the older I get, the better I’m becoming I hope.
Jonathan V.: It’s good that you can see that blind spot though. I think it’s a common one for guys to have this tendency to switch directly into problem-solving mode, or very quickly. And maybe sometimes I certainly have before I’ve gotten all the facts even, right?
Duane Bennett: Yes. That’s something that they tell you, that’s something I’m trained not to do, but I do it, so it’s a blinder. I have to work on it.
Jonathan V.: So is it as a writer, did you see Britt’s inclination towards writing when she was living with, in the household and were there things that you did to encourage that, or foster that along?
Duane Bennett: Yeah. I, you know, I did see it in Britt and I didn’t know how serious it was because she was such an avid reader. You know, we encouraged reading and literary arts. You know, we have a lot of books at our house and she would read and read and read and read. And so we encourage that because we figured that if she did a lot of reading, somehow success would come with that reading. You know, you just educate your mind, your vocabulary broadens, your sentence structure becomes better. The more you read. So we certainly encourage that. And I saw her righty and even in secondary school and middle school and high school where the students would do journals, you could see that she was a great writer. And I remember this one competition that Britt had, where they had them write essays. And the students who participated in the, you know, in the writing contest, they had to write an essay in a room by themselves, etcetera, and Britt wrote this essay. And the judges gave her a real, real bad score saying that she plagiarized. They said, there’s no way that a student from this school could have written this well. Oh, it’s horrible.
And boy, did our family, like I say, the close knitness of our family really, really came up because don’t, don’t criticize one of the sisters, boy the sisters and my wife just, you know, they were beside themselves because they were horrible to say that she plagiarized when she didn’t, she stood right in the room and she just constructed excellent, you know, a very well-written essay and people condemned her, you know? And the thing about it, think about it as African-Americans, as a black people, a lot of times people underestimate us and they don’t think we can write and they don’t think we can think. There’s no way in the world. You could have written like this, but it’s possible. And there are a lot of people who deserve more credit than society wants to give them credit for. We are proud by people, you know, we don’t feel, it’s like I say, we don’t feel that we’re less than, or better than anybody. We didn’t teach them in our house that we’re better than the other. We didn’t teach prejudice and discrimination in our house. We love everybody. You know, we love everybody and we’re, non-judgmental towards people. But as a young writer, when that, you know, when Britt went through that experience, I mean, that was a motivator for her and for all of us to really say, Hey, look, we’ll show you. We know what we’re doing. And we’re capable of a lot more than you give us credit for.
Jonathan V.: You mentioned earlier that the civil rights movement is something that that’s important to you and has been important to you for a while. Is that something that you talked about with your daughters?
Duane Bennett: Yeah. If we talk about prejudice, discrimination, racism, inequality all the time. And we did that when they were young, we had a lot of conversations about it because we had to go through things such as a Rodney King incident in some of the, you know, like the George Floyd incident. And you know whenever we see prejudice, discrimination and treatment towards people and it’s, untoured, that it’s unjust. It evokes passion in our whole family. I mean, I, you know, look, I spent my life fighting for equal justice and for civil rights. And I think my daughters all of us have that. And we’re all sensitive to that. And it, I think created a passion in our entire family to fight for equality and to fight for civil rights for people. And, you know, I didn’t hide it from my daughters, you know, when we grew up, I mean, the fact of the matter is we’re are black folk. Sometimes we’re going to be treated worse than other people, and we’re going to face discrimination. We’re going to face prejudice, but you know what, don’t let it stop. You keep going on. You’re not inferior to anybody. You just keep on working at it, and we’ll get through this.
Jonathan V.: I understand you personally have had some difficult experiences with racism. I imagine more than one. The one that I had read about in something that Brit wrote was when you were pulled over by the police as a deputy district attorney before you had children, would you feel comfortable telling that story?
Duane Bennett: Yeah, well, I, you know, I teach and I tell it all the time. I think that, you know, when I saw the recent spate of black lives matter cases, it really, really brought it back to me. I was in now, I grew up in South Central LA and my mother lives two blocks from USC in around 1985, 86. That’s right in the hood as we call it and one night, I was coming home. I was actually coming home from a church meeting when I saw LAPD behind me. And of course I was going to drive carefully when I saw the police behind me. And all of a sudden I saw two units approaching me from the opposite direction. And I pulled over, you know, to allow the emergency vehicles to pass. And I didn’t realize that they were coming from me. Ultimately I was stopped. I was taken out of the car at gunpoint. I was handcuffed, arrested, thrown to the curb with a gun pointed right at me, two shotguns and four revolvers. And I had done nothing at the time I got stopped. I was a deputy district attorney. I was an attorney and I happened to live in Los Angeles, but I was commuting from Riverside County to LA county. I wish I had done nothing, but my father had told me about driving while black.
And then he gave me the call and I complied and I didn’t say anything, but I still to this day, had I reacted in a different way, or if I started flailing in my arms or something like that, I probably would have died. And I, you know, one further if we call them in the law of one furtive gesture could have ended my life that night. Thing about it, they never even asked for my name. They never, they never checked my ID. It’s just the fact that I’m black and they figured somehow they never fully explained to me why they stopped me, why they handcuffed me, why they threw me to the curb, why they put a gun to the back of my head. They never explained it. And they never apologized. I filed a claim, never got an apology. So, you know, you, you realize, Hey, this is, you know, being black in America, if you lead to experience. And it doesn’t matter if you’re an attorney, doesn’t matter if you’re a prostitute or working with police officers, you’re still subject to the same treatment. So I don’t, you know, mix words when I see these cases, I, you know, I love law enforcement. I’ve defended law enforcement. I’ve represented five separate police departments, but I realize that law enforcement has many challenges that they need to grapple with. So yeah, it’s one of those things.
Jonathan V.: Could I ask how do you talk to your kids about when a Rodney King or a George Floyd type of instance happens? What do you say to your children?
Duane Bennett: It’s a very difficult discussion. As I indicated, it’s, you know, being black in America, it’s different. And you know, we have civil rights statutes that help us understand and address some of these issues. I always tell people, however, that, and I tell my, I tell my daughters the same thing. Look, you can’t count on the criminal justice system to rectify all the problems because it has never happened consistently for African-Americans. It just has never happened consistently. I’m not saying it shouldn’t, I’m just saying you can’t expect it to, and then when it doesn’t, you know, fall apart and just go off. I mean, the fact that matter is we have civil laws that we can use to help us address some of the problems that we see in law enforcement and throughout society. And a lot of these laws offer will help us change policies and practices that need to be changed. I have to tell, you know, people like I tell my daughters, look, these things happen. Unfortunately, it means that we have a lot of work in this society.
It means that there are issues and there are things that happen that aren’t right. It doesn’t mean that everybody’s a racist, that everybody is discriminatory. It doesn’t mean that all law enforcement is bad because it’s not the vast majority of police officers that I’ve interacted with have been great, great, great people. But there are some challenges with law enforcement. It’s not an all or nothing thing. That’s your all for us, or you’re all against us. I mean, we have to address those issues that are out there. And, you know, as black people we can’t give up. I mean, you have to just keep on, you have to just keep on fighting. You have to educate yourself, make sure you’re aware of your rights and what is right in society. And you can’t be afraid to speak out against what’s wrong. And so I, you know, we have voices and we have to use those voices to try to effectuate positive change in this society.
Jonathan V.: Is there any advice that you might give to white fathers about how they should talk to their kids about racism?
Duane Bennett: Oh boy, that’s a good question. Well, you know, I had some neighbors of mine right after George Floyd, white neighbors, and they were walking down the street and they saw me and we live in a neighborhood where there aren’t a whole bunch of black folks and they say, Duane what do you think of this? And what do we tell our children? And I’ll tell you what I told them. I say, tell them that black lives matter. And for those people, for those folk out there who say, no, no, no, all lives matter. I know all lives should matter. I know I get that all lives should matter. Just doesn’t seem like they do. The night that I got pulled over by LAPD and you know, and they pulled guns on me and put guns to the back of my head and handcuffed me and threw me, my life didn’t matter. The only thing that matter without black and I was in the inner city, I didn’t get an apology. I didn’t get any compensation or anything. I almost died just because of who I am. So I tell you no white parents, you know, tell your children the black lives matter. And that it doesn’t mean that black lives matter to the exclusion of anybody else’s life.
It’s just that we matter, you know, the least thing that you can say about a person is that you matter. Not that you’re better than not, that you’re less than attitude greater than you just matter. You just matter. If society can’t tell people and you know why people can’t tell their children that black people matter. I don’t know what to say. You know? So I told them, tell him that black lives matter and that there is injustice in society. If not all bad, it’s not all good, but there is injustice. And there are people who have different experiences then you do. And for those people who believe that we need to maintain the status quo or make America great again, I just challenge them to tell us when America was ever great for everybody. Yeah. Make America great again, take us back to where we were. When, what would that during Jim Crow days? Was that During the days of segregation? You know, that during the Watts riots? When was it good for everybody? Now, America is a great idea and, and society had the great idea, but I think we need to keep working to perfect it so that everybody has the right to equality and equal justice.
Jonathan V.: Yeah. Well said. So if you’ve got a few more minutes, I’ve just got a few closing questions. Do you have a bit more time?
Duane Bennett: Sure, sure.
Jonathan V.: Wonderful. So what are three words that you think your kids or your wife might use to describe your parenting style?
Duane Bennett: They would say loving, supportive, and protective. Yeah. I think they know I give my life for them and when they are confronted, I do everything I can to figure out a way to cover them.
Jonathan V.: With the benefit of hindsight, what’s something that you might’ve done differently as a father?
Duane Bennett: I would have listened more carefully, like, for example, in Britt’s case, when she was explaining what she wanted to do in her career, I heard her, but I didn’t really hear. So she wanted to write and she wanted to be an author. And I kind of heard that and I kind of didn’t, it just didn’t make sense to me, but that’s, that was my fault. I just did not understand how it would materialize for her. And it did in hindsight, as I grow and as I mature, I realized that they have their own thoughts. They know in their own minds, what they want to do. And sometimes this whole notion of if I were you, I would do X, it’s not the right thing. Keep in mind that the main goal that you have, as a parent, is to love your family unconditionally. I think the rest of it will fall in line.
Jonathan V.: Well, you are definitely an excellent father, Duane, and you’ve got some terrific daughters. Thank you very much for your time. I really truly enjoyed our conversation. This has been fantastic.
Duane Bennett: Thank you so much, Jonathan. Thank you so much, man. And thanks again. Thanks again for what you guys are doing and we need more of this.